It's not very often, but sometimes I really feel like I'm living in a science-fiction type future. I am so excited to see where mankind goes in my lifetime.
Let's put twin ion engines on the spacecraft and make it give off a really cool whining noise as is streaks past, kinda like a fighter. Hmmmm. I wonder what we could call a ship like that?
Read about this last week. Hope they get it working. The problem with propulsion in space has always been a payload issue, so anything they can do to alleviate that is great, especially if it comes with added speed.
@Belabras: Unless ion engines are shooting out particles WAY faster than a rocket, I think this is more about g-forces and acceleration than any space saving. You'd probably need more fuel to speed up faster and then brake than the "one burst of acceleration" method of rockets.
Based on basic physics, I think you still need to be shooting mass out to gain momentum, it's more the problem that rockets can ONLY accelerate quickly in short bursts. Thus, to get up to the same speed as a gradual engine, you'd need to have lots of rockets fired in bursts that won't kill the astronauts with sheer G forces. The ion engine will have to expend more fuel/energy than a rocket to get going faster (basic momentum conservation, I think), but the fact that it can do this gradually is actually the main advantage here.
EDIT: Now that I think about it, the ability to store tons of energy using nuclear power is probably a space-saver, since you need less fuel and just use the nuclear-produced electricity to power the ion engines. My bad, should have thought that through more completely.
@kagekiri: BUt you see they ION engines are shooting out particles faster than a rocket. IN fact they are way, way waaay faster. Which means you need LESS fuel, not more, as the faste ions shooting out the back of an ion engine have a much higher energy to matter ratio than the slower chemical fuels used in rockets.
And "g-force related problems" has nothing to do with why ION engines are better, making the rest of your post completely moot.
This is the rocket being developed by former astronaut Chang-Diaz right? I just watched something on PBS about this, and never was the moniker VASIMR mentioned; they only called it a plasma rocket. I hope it works.
@ihfiapc: This inscrutable link was meant to inspire discussion of whether one option for longer spaceflight might be artificial gravity simulated by centripetal force. For reals, is there any reason this wouldn't work?
@ihfiapc: Creating enough rotation to adequately create gravity is probably beyond the comfortable limits of our materials. We simply don't need the gravity that badly.
And now that we can get to wherever we're going faster, the degradation that goes along with zero-gravity isn't as bad. 39 days is nothing compared to what some of those guys pull on the ISS.
@Log1c: Yes. Might be helpful for several reasons. There is backlash against transporting nuclear materials into orbit through the atmosphere in case of mishap, and of course lunar gravity is low making the energy cost of sending things off-moon for use elsewhere lower (once you're there in the first place).
Of course, you can't put raw ore in a reactor. Mining and enrichment requires a substantial infrastructure that no one will re-create on the Moon (and it will be more difficult because it is the Moon) without a very good, profitable reason. A handful of ships to Mars won't be it...
@Annalee Newitz: Actually it would still be a beowulf cluster. Aside from very technical issues, there is no serious scaling limit on beowulf cluster managment software.
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As long as we don't name the ship Ares Seven, and get work on bubble drive tech, stat, we should be fine.
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@alphanumeric1971: That's the real reason why they want to test it on the ISS, I mean, c'mon, have you seen the thing through a telescope recently?
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That's true of a lot of systems on current space faring vessels. Not a good reason to rule this out.
07/27/09
http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/sciencenow/0403/04.html
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buzzkiller
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Based on basic physics, I think you still need to be shooting mass out to gain momentum, it's more the problem that rockets can ONLY accelerate quickly in short bursts. Thus, to get up to the same speed as a gradual engine, you'd need to have lots of rockets fired in bursts that won't kill the astronauts with sheer G forces. The ion engine will have to expend more fuel/energy than a rocket to get going faster (basic momentum conservation, I think), but the fact that it can do this gradually is actually the main advantage here.
EDIT: Now that I think about it, the ability to store tons of energy using nuclear power is probably a space-saver, since you need less fuel and just use the nuclear-produced electricity to power the ion engines. My bad, should have thought that through more completely.
07/27/09
And "g-force related problems" has nothing to do with why ION engines are better, making the rest of your post completely moot.
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Soooo...
07/27/09
Discuss!
07/27/09
And now that we can get to wherever we're going faster, the degradation that goes along with zero-gravity isn't as bad. 39 days is nothing compared to what some of those guys pull on the ISS.
07/27/09
Yup. Coriolis effect.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Artificial_gravity
Anything as small as the Discovery foot-track (or even the Leonov's rotating arms) wouldn't be big enough in diameter.
That said, perhaps even a *little* artificial gravity might go a long way towards keep folks healthy.
07/27/09
Problem is, what ever they decide to use, 1g acceleration is pretty close to the limit of what your going to be able to do.
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Of course, you can't put raw ore in a reactor. Mining and enrichment requires a substantial infrastructure that no one will re-create on the Moon (and it will be more difficult because it is the Moon) without a very good, profitable reason. A handful of ships to Mars won't be it...
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Like all forms of propulsion in space, there aren't so much breaks as just reversing the direction of the engine.
07/27/09
Reverse the polarity of the ion flow?
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Linux rules.
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