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Dinosaur Creationism Theme Park Seized By The Government
"Expelled" Conspiracy?
San Francisco, 4:45 PM
Mon Dec 7
24 posts in the last 24 hours
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08/06/09
And then we have Religious Education. Where we learn about all religions and their stories and such. They are separate but allow us to comes to our own decisions about the world we live in.
I have read about creationists trying to force creationsim into science, despite creationism having no SCIENTIFIC basis.
Here US, this is something you can borrow from us limeys. A science class and a religious class.
08/07/09
Don't let the fact that American Christians refrain from burning other sects at the stake. They c-r-a-z-y!
(but catch 'em on the right night and they'll do anal since it means their virginity will remain intact)
08/06/09
I can't see creationists looking at the newer literature for their own theories... they seem hellbent on studying the same old outdated 2000 year old edition.
08/05/09
Look, no one has ever produced substantial evidence that 'absolutely' proves Darwinian evolution. Microevolution [change or adaptation within species] was known before Darwin and there has been little to no gainsay. This by no means entails Macroevolution has ever occured. In actual fact, there is no evidence to show that macroevolution [life forms changing into new species] has happened. To convey that macroevolution is proven fact is prevarication and would be falsifying fact. FACT IS there is no evidence--none; in the fossil record, molecular biology and many sciences actually. To look at the conclusive grounds minus any of your preconceptions you would see there is much evidence to the contrary. Take the fossil record for instance: instead of defending evolution successfully it goes against it and reinforces intelligent design.
Look at evolution with nice discernment and honestly at Intelligent design, you will realize that the evidence is not on the side of evolution but on the side of ID.
If one espoused Darwinism and it's inherent premise of naturalism, one believes: disorder produces information, unconsciousness produces conciousness, inanimation produces life.
08/05/09
Wow. So you've never actually read a book about Darwin's theory* or evolution, have you? Of course not. And why should you? Because it's WRONG and you're RIGHT. You can quote dozens of experts who have found ways of fitting kludged together facts to fit a few passages of metaphor from an ancient text that has gone through numerous translations and interpretation.
Fine, whatever, "Teach the Controversy". But wouldn't it be more useful to concentrate on the the moral lessons of The Bible and finding ways of achieving the greater love and acceptance of all humanity that Jesus taught?
Does Science really get in the way of that?
Could it possibly threaten your faith that much? I am certain this is not the case.
* No evolution hasn't been 'absolutely' proven, that's not how actual science works. There is however enough evidence collected over the last century or so that has led a vast majority of people trained to judge empirical evidence to agree that, yeah, there might be something to this whole evolution thing. It's a Theory, that's what the word means.
08/06/09
[www.nature.com]
08/05/09
I don't know if anyone is still reading this foofaraw, but I'd just like to add something.
Some of these comments (and similar, whenever the subject of religion raises its pointed head) truly disturb me. There are far too many folks out there who fervently wave the Godless banner of Dawkinisim and seem to insist anyone who has any religious beliefs should be rounded up and put in camps. And not the fun kind with canoe rides and macaroni art. Honestly, some of you Fundementalist Atheists kinda scare me.
I wasn't raised with any religious influence at all. This probably gives me a handicap in all this bitchin' moral superiority that some of the Enlightened Atheists have. I can't moan how Sister Mary Margaret made my life a living Hell, but now I've Seen the Light of Rationality. "Me so smart now, pbpbpllphht! Take that, Jesus! Neener, neener, neener!"
Bitch, please.
Most religious people are quite rational and tolerant. They go about their lives and contribute to society without blowing up bus stops or wearing "God Hates Fags" signs. The tiny, itsy-bitsy minority of hate-mongers will always attract more attention than your friends and neighbors who go to church or temple or whatever. They are not holding back civilization. They are planning bake sales.
Religion will not explain all the mysteries of the Universe, that's not its job, never was. Proof denies Faith or something to that effect. Nor can Science ever disprove the existence of God. Sorry, can't be done.
I'm not terribly good at all this long-headed Smart stuff, but please check out the writings of some very intelligent folks who are no strangers to io9 and have been jawin' about just this sorta thing:
[threatquality.com]
Yay for Moff and Braak!
08/05/09
There definitely are rational, thoughtful people on both sides, and while I really don't think it's a matter of "Let's agree to disagree," I think we all need to be willing to work with one another to discover more about our universe.
08/05/09
I promote every word of this comment.
08/05/09
Regardless, you can believe anything you like. Its your right and no one should wish to take that right away from you as long as it does no harm to others.
Unfortunately, your words take on the same disturbing tone that has dominated religious thought for the last couple centuries. You act like a victim. Like you expect an attack. Your respective belief systems have held the majority in this world for quite some time and now that it is threatened by a growing secular population the majority rhetoric takes on a more extremist tone. You don't seem like an extremist. You actually seem quite reasonable in most respects, but when push comes to shove who are you in here defending? Clearly you identify more with a creationalist than you do an atheist or agnostic. You ask us to see a line that you yourself waver between depending upon the subject under discussion.
There is a conflict inherent in any modern religionist. Do you believe what you can see or do you believe what you are told? And...having made that choice can you accept the presence of its inverse within another human being without fear or disdain?
08/05/09
"If you ain't with us, you against us!", eh?
Perhaps my problem is that I honestly don't see any problem with letting people being religious or the inverse as long as, as you yourself stated, it does no harm to others. And by harm I include being a big ol' meanie-face to folks who disagree with you.
Sigh. But then again this is the Internet, ain't it? Good night and sleep tight.
xxxooo,
Grey Area
08/06/09
"Fundamentalist Atheist" is almost as redundant as it is stupid. I believe in the fundamentals of... reality? Other atheists believe in a slightly less real reality? Some people adhere to a strictly more logical view of logic? At least Dawkins knows what side of the debate he stands on.
I read a lot of these comments and I wasn't particularly 'frightened' by any one person's opinions on this matter. I didn't see anyone shouting about internment camps. Wherever there are these kinds of debates there will be softy "everybody's right in their own way" people like you, and no one gains anything productive from all your blah blah blah.
08/06/09
Good sweet fuck, what are you thinking, wading into an argument like this without even knowing your own vocabulary? Insulting another person, casting aspersions, standing secure in your fat paunch of self regard without actually knowing what you're talking about?
That seems to me to be antithetical to basic reason. Though, because I'm not an idiot, I know that you might still be an atheist.
08/06/09
"If you ain't with us, you against us!", eh?"
I don't believe anyone in this thread said anything even remotely resembling that. Its funny that you accused me of not reading your post when clearly you skimmed mine. Not once did I mention Darwin. Not once did I insult you for believing in a Deity. I did, however, accuse you of having a victim complex...clearly I was wrong.
08/05/09
08/05/09
Which sounds more believable here folks:
The belief that a cosmic Jewish Zombie who was his own father can make you live forever if you symbolically eat his flesh and telepathically tell him you accept him as your master, so he can remove an evil force from your soul that is present in humanity because a rib-woman was convinced by a talking snake to eat from a magical tree...
or....
Man has gone through several Evolutions (Not Exactly From Apes) to become what we are today. *Think Atheist*
"Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able? Then he is not omnipotent.
Is he able, but not willing? Then he is malevolent.
Is he both able and willing? Then whence cometh evil?
Is he neither able nor willing? Then why call him God?"
- Epicurus
08/05/09
The quote you posted is pretty weak, too. Those questions have only been addressed, oh, about a thousand times over centuries of philosophical and theological thought. Read up, dude.
08/06/09
That's a pretty bold statement. It also means that I must not be a Christian, despite claiming to be so for the past 15-odd years.
For the record, I also believe in evolution. It's called 'Theistic Evolution' - look it up. I am completely able to believe what I want to believe without trying to force you to believe it as well, thanks.
08/05/09
** It was primarily conservative Christians who indicted, tried, and convicted these loonies **
Just like it was Christians who have created most of the scientific breakthroughs in the last several centuries, including the theory of evolution.
08/05/09
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08/05/09
And by thank them I mean punch them as hard as I can in their most tender areas.
08/05/09
08/05/09
Now, religious people touting their beliefs as science without proper scientific peer review (or peer acceptance), I cannot understand.
Then again, perhaps their 'peers' are not the scientific community the general populace acknowledges, but the 'scientific' community that supports their beliefs.
Also, this:
08/05/09
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08/05/09
If dinos and humans lived on the planet together - they would have eaten us all. And why no mention of dinos in the bible? "And lo, Jesus healed the big lizard's foot?"
They CAN"T DENY the existance of dinos, so they incorporate them into their creation story. Can we at least acknowledge however that the order of creation follows the order of evolution... creatures of the water, then land, then air... then us. Hmmm. amazing coincidence.
You think maybe God, divinely INSPIRED evolution - SINCE TIME doesn't mean anything to God. And how much MORE amazing is it that process would lead to creatures that are self-aware as opposed to the POW - there it is, elementary school answers.
08/05/09
Why don't they just deny the existence of dinosaurs? Just come up with some mumbo jumbo like "Have you ever seen a live dinosaur?" or "Yes, we found bones but they were put there for us to find."
08/05/09
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08/05/09
Oh why not. That low hanging fruit looks goooood.
[www.youtube.com]
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