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San Francisco, 12:15 AM
Thu Dec 10
25 posts in the last 24 hours

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    Dsmvwl  Admin  Promote to frontpage Approve user Ban user ×
    Image of bookling bookling
    12/06/09

    In reply to Dollhouse Gets Political, And Our Minds Are Blown
    There's one thing I don't get: who did Topher think Bennett was going to be? He was clearly expecting an older lady, and then seemed to think that the "real" Bennett had put herself into an active like the doctor with Whiskey back in LA. Since Topher discovered Bennett isn't a doll, what's the deal?

    Oh, and Victor as Topher made my night. He's so good! When they were together at the end, with Victor waiting to get wiped, they kept doing the same mannerisms at the same time. I loved it.
     Reply
    bookling was starred bookling was unstarred
    Image of MargaretMoony MargaretMoony
    12/06/09

    In reply to Dollhouse Gets Political, And Our Minds Are Blown
    Did they ever say if Bennett Halverson had Tourette's because she was sure acting like it.
     Reply
    MargaretMoony was starred MargaretMoony was unstarred
    Image of Kessica Kessica
    12/07/09

    @MargaretMoony: I thought it might have been schizophrenia since she seemed to have a lot of internal struggles and also because Topher mentioned it at one point and I felt like there may have been tension between "You could have ended up with a schizophrenic" and Bennet's answer.

    I don't know, what it was, but there was definitely something off about her that can't be explained by super smarts.
     Reply
    MargaretMoony promoted this comment Kessica was starred Kessica was unstarred
    Image of MargaretMoony MargaretMoony
    12/07/09

    @Kessica: Seriously, I know there's smart-kooky but she was just plain kooky-kooky.
     Reply
    MargaretMoony was starred MargaretMoony was unstarred
    Image of Kishi Kishi
    12/06/09

    In reply to Dollhouse Gets Political, And Our Minds Are Blown
    I did love that the DC dollhouse names them after gods- that seems fitting. And, as my wife pointed out, Echo fits into both naming schemes.

    And... Freaking Enver Gjokaj. Just amazing.
     Reply
    Kishi was starred Kishi was unstarred
    Image of iCurmudgeon iCurmudgeon
    12/06/09

    In reply to Dollhouse Gets Political, And Our Minds Are Blown
    Poor Summer Glau. Is she ever going to get a role where she's not some kind of psycho bitch? I'd like to see her playing someone normal.
     Reply
    iCurmudgeon was starred iCurmudgeon was unstarred
    Image of Tomb: R.O.A.C.H. Tomb: R.O.A.C.H.
    12/05/09

    In reply to Dollhouse Gets Political, And Our Minds Are Blown
    What if the reason Caroline become a doll has something to do with what she did to Rive.. eh.. Glau.
     Reply
    Tomb: R.O.A.C.H. was starred Tomb: R.O.A.C.H. was unstarred
    Image of Stephen Goldmeier Stephen Goldmeier
    12/05/09

    @Tomb: R.O.A.C.H.: this is both what i assumed and what would very easily rescue the bennet bits in this episode.
     Reply
    Stephen Goldmeier was starred Stephen Goldmeier was unstarred
    Image of Alessar Alessar
    12/05/09

    @Stephen Goldmeier: That was my take too. Plus, she's completely insane. Like, so insane Topher seems normal in comparison.
     Reply
    Alessar was starred Alessar was unstarred
    Image of MooglesAndCats MooglesAndCats
    12/06/09

    @Alessar: @Alessar: She's so insane that, for a moment, I thought Alpha was going to make an appearance.
     Reply
    Alessar promoted this comment SJ_Edwards approved this comment MooglesAndCats was starred MooglesAndCats was unstarred
    Image of Alessar Alessar
    12/06/09

    @MooglesAndCats: I would not rule out the possibility that Bennet and Alpha were in cahoots.
     Reply
    Alessar was starred Alessar was unstarred
    Image of MooglesAndCats MooglesAndCats
    12/08/09

    @Alessar: The whole talking to herself thing that Bennet did is what made me think about split personalities. Can losing an arm really make you that crazy? I guess we'll find out next week if she had anything to do with imprinting Alpha to be the way he is.
     Reply
    MooglesAndCats was starred MooglesAndCats was unstarred
    Image of Alessar Alessar
    12/08/09

    @MooglesAndCats: or if Alpha did anything to make her the way she is. I guess one thing that came out of these episodes is that we know that Topher is NOT a doll. I didn't think it was likely but I did think it was possible.
     Reply
    Alessar was starred Alessar was unstarred
    Image of Pants McCracky Pants McCracky
    12/05/09

    In reply to Dollhouse Gets Political, And Our Minds Are Blown
    I guess I wasn't all that bothered by quirky/weird Bennett, because, well, it's Summer Glau, and she's on a Joss Whedon show. What is she supposed to be...not weird?

    Back when they revealed the existence of other Dollhouses, I wondered if the eventual course of the series would be the L.A. Dollhouse going rogue and taking on the other Dollhouses and whatever shadowy powers that be that were controlling the whole thing. It was an appealing thought, because the series at that point was just too bleak for my tastes. Our protagonists were either mind-wiped zombies or amoral pimps -- aside from Ballard, who was, frankly, kind of dull, there wasn't anyone to really root for or sympathize with. Not even Echo, since there really was no there there, as they say.

    I thought at the time that the show could really grab me if they could somehow turn Adele and crew into (deeply flawed) heroes, and put the show into a more familiar Whedonesque groove of a quirkily intrepid band of Scoobies going up against a Big Bad. Yeah, just like every Whedon series, but dammit, this is what he does best, and it's why I love the guy. Plus, I just didn't see the series being able to sustain over multiple seasons without evolving out of its initial concept.

    So, now it seems like the show is in fact moving in this direction, which is neat. This wasn't just a top-notch pair of episodes -- these were episodes that showed me how this series could actually move forward beyond the current season, and really engage my heart as well as my mind. Unfortunately, any satisfaction I feel is vastly overshadowed by one question for Mr. Joss Whedon: WHY THE HELL DIDN'T YOU DO THIS BACK IN SEASON ONE WHEN IT MIGHT HAVE MADE A DIFFERENCE???
     Reply
    Pants McCracky was starred Pants McCracky was unstarred
    Image of TheLostVikings R.O.A.C.H. TheLostVikings R.O.A.C.H.
    12/06/09

    @Pants McCracky: The very first ep Joss made was of Ballard discovering Echo and entering the Dollhouse, so the first season was essentially all filler because FOX ordered him to. Which worked out so well...
     Reply
    TheLostVikings R.O.A.C.H. was starred TheLostVikings R.O.A.C.H. was unstarred
    Image of Dr Emilio Lizardo Dr Emilio Lizardo
    12/05/09

    In reply to Dollhouse Gets Political, And Our Minds Are Blown
    I have a feeling Microsoft just slapped their logo on a FOX produced commercial. I think that's the way the network sees this show, which is why it's been cancelled.
     Reply
    Dr Emilio Lizardo was starred Dr Emilio Lizardo was unstarred
    Image of Hobarookus Hobarookus
    12/05/09

    @Dr Emilio Lizardo: Regardless of whether or not the entire network sees Dollhouse that way, it certainly seems to be the way the marketing department's seeing it...and that's half the battle for any show.

    (Of course, the other half of the battle is programming slots, so...)

    And that commercial is definitely a FOX production. It just reeks of the "Dollhouse=sex and hotness!" angle that's always being pushed around.
     Reply
    ggodo, the man from R.O.A.C.H. promoted this comment Hobarookus was starred Hobarookus was unstarred
    Image of DrMathochist DrMathochist
    12/05/09

    In reply to Dollhouse Gets Political, And Our Minds Are Blown
    I saw the Senator Perrin twist coming. The whole white-knight thing was a bit too much to take.

    I'm disappointed that Topher moved back towards being an asshole. He'd almost grown something resembling a conscience. On the other hand, Victopher was brilliant.

    Well-done: choreographing the fight scene to match clips from earlier episodes.

    Not well-done: Senator Perrin's penchant for bending Eliza Duskhu over a series of tables. The bathroom scene was particularly gratuitous; and maybe sexist for showing him removing her chip and not vice versa.

    Oh, and I hope that now that November is going back to being a doll again they'll get rid of that ridiculous fucking tan.
     Reply
    DrMathochist was starred DrMathochist was unstarred
    Image of geesejuggler geesejuggler
    12/05/09

    In reply to Dollhouse Gets Political, And Our Minds Are Blown
    It was awesome! First, the last thing I needed as a fangirl was a Victor/Topher. His scenes in the episode might beat his "Kiki" scenes.

    Second, I originally thought that Madeline was a imprint on November soo that she could kill the senator but him being a doll was great too.

    Bennet was great. She reminded me of a evil River/Topher/Adelle lovechild. She had her ticks, moral gray areas but still had kinda a slick headmistress feel about her (when she first popped up).

    I'm actually sad that it's getting cancelled but it's better to get cancel with a bang.
     Reply
    geesejuggler was starred geesejuggler was unstarred
    Image of MargaretMoony MargaretMoony
    12/05/09

    In reply to Dollhouse Gets Political, And Our Minds Are Blown
    You know, I might be the only person on the planet, but I have all sorts of love for Mellie/Madeline/November. I think her whole plot line was interesting and heartbreaking and deserved WAY more screen time.

    I also wished they'd handled the Echo realizing she's a separate person from Caroline better.
     Reply
    MargaretMoony was starred MargaretMoony was unstarred
    Image of RoboBagins RoboBagins
    12/05/09

    In reply to Dollhouse Gets Political, And Our Minds Are Blown
    I totally called the senator is a doll bit the moment it looked like his wife was a doll. It just seemed like it would be more twisted that way. So yeah.

    On Summer Glau, completely and totally annoying. Why? Because this is just a slight readjustment of Cameron and River. I'm tired of seeing that. It's just played out. On Firefly, that's who she was, on TSCC well, she was a creepy Termmie who stole the personality of a real girl. Did she have to be nearly the same person for Dollhouse? I swear, she was better used in that episode of the big bang theory where she played herself.

    Hell I'm actually kinda put off they used any sort of nerd cliche for the DC programmer.

    I did give Topher an hand when he punched out Bennet. That was unexpected.
     Reply
    RoboBagins was starred RoboBagins was unstarred
    Image of firstanointed firstanointed
    12/05/09

    In reply to Dollhouse Gets Political, And Our Minds Are Blown
    I loved the sheer complexity of the story development but what hinders me from being completely happy with the ep is that a lot of the dialogue --particularly from the Senator and his handler felt very stilted. Usually Dollhouse dialogue flows a bit like a graphic novel, but there seemed to be a lot of expositional dialogue that could have been conveyed without so much emphasis/explaining from the characters.

    Summer Glau's scenes with everybody were phenomenal. Maybe I just like damaged, crazy characters, but watching her interact with the other crazies was a helluva lot of fun. Her neurosis and Topher-esque immorality added that much more to the character, so I didn't mind much that her vendetta against Echo/Caroline was rather contrived.

    Enver Gjokaj stole the show though with his eerie impression of Topher. When an actor can accurately portray another actor's portrayal of a character, that's just...WIN.
     Reply
    firstanointed was starred firstanointed was unstarred
    Image of Lassus Lassus
    12/05/09

    @firstanointed: This strikes me as a good criticism. I admit that the overall idea, the acting, and the themes were all better than I thought they would be. It kept me around for the second hour.

    However, the writing and dialogue was pretty meh. Topher's little limousine scene, the stuff between the senator and Echo, between Adelle and, er, the Devil, Bennett's assistant, there was a lot of the writing that was incredibly weak to my ears overall.

    As one more positive, I actually thought that the actress playing the senator's wife/handler - Stacey Scowley - did a great job with her character, both as the devoted wife and sinister handler.
     Reply
    Lassus was starred Lassus was unstarred
    Image of firstanointed firstanointed
    12/05/09

    @Lassus: Yeah I agree. Stacey did a fantastic job convincingly pulling off the jarring duality of her character. Again though, the issue of the words she had to say sounding rather...wooden, I guess, detracted a bit from the performance, but otherwise she and the actor who portrayed the Senator too did good jobs.

    I usually enjoy Dollhouse's dialogue with no problem, but it seemed off the usual mark for these two episodes. Thankfully the story itself was written very well.
     Reply
    firstanointed was starred firstanointed was unstarred
    Image of Darklighter Darklighter
    12/05/09

    In reply to Dollhouse Gets Political, And Our Minds Are Blown
    Am I the only one who had to quadruple check that Enver Gjokaj wasn't being dubbed by Fran Krantz? Because his impression was just so damn perfect.
     Reply
    Darklighter was starred Darklighter was unstarred
    Image of Elle Elle
    12/05/09

    @Darklighter: I totally wondered that myself, it was too perfect! I couldn't help but laugh every time he was on screen, I'm all for more Victor-being-Topher!
     Reply
    ggodo, the man from R.O.A.C.H. promoted this comment Elle was starred Elle was unstarred
    Image of Gemi Gemi
    12/05/09

    @Darklighter: If I hadn't already seen Enver's Dominic performance, I would've been 100% convinced that he'd been overdubbed. At one point, he does this "Ahh!" noise and it was so spot-on, I laughed. Watching Topher and Victor-Topher in the same room, riffing off each other, completely blew my mind.
     Reply
    ggodo, the man from R.O.A.C.H. promoted this comment Gemi was starred Gemi was unstarred
    Image of Susan B. Susan B.
    12/05/09

    @Darklighter: Ditto. I really, really hope we get to see more of this actor once the show's done.
     Reply
    Susan B. was starred Susan B. was unstarred
    Image of betty.black betty.black
    12/05/09

    @Susan B.: Right on.

    I think he's done the best job of any cast member to use the show and material he's been given as a serious springboard for his versatility as an actor—more so than say, Dushku. His command of accents, switching seamlessly between serious roles, tender roles, hero/sidekick/villain/character-acting, comic timing. He's managed to make himself pretty untypecastable, which is a feat as well.

    It's a real resume-piece for him, which is of course how every actor should view every role.

    And for the record, I was convinced he was overdubbed, too!
     Reply
    ggodo, the man from R.O.A.C.H. promoted this comment Edited by betty.black at 12/05/09 7:33 PM betty.black was starred betty.black was unstarred
    Image of MsFeasance MsFeasance
    12/06/09

    @Gemi: It reminded me of something that Billy West said in the commentary of one of the Futurama movies (I think it's Bender's Big Score)--that whenever you get two copies of one person in the same place, they always hate the things that annoy them about themselves.
     Reply
    MsFeasance was starred MsFeasance was unstarred
    Image of WestMantooth WestMantooth
    12/05/09

    In reply to Dollhouse Gets Political, And Our Minds Are Blown
    The thing I noticed about the Caroline scene is that none of them match. All the previous times we've seen Echo she's presented to us a different way. Adelle's Caroline was a stubborn, silent type. Echo's Caroline was a feisty, anarchist. Now Bennett's Caroline is a totally manipulative jerk.

    I think it's a mystery furthering the idea of who we are as seen through other people.
     Reply
    WestMantooth was starred WestMantooth was unstarred
    Image of ggodo, the man from R.O.A.C.H. ggodo, the man from R.O.A.C.H.
    12/06/09

    @WestMantooth: And part of this is Caroline over time. College Caroline wanted to free the monkeys and then got more serious, more fanatical. She teamed up with Glau to blow up some building, probably one of Rossum's, and when the roof came down she ran. After spending an unknown time on the run we find her with Adelle signing her contract.
     Reply
    ggodo, the man from R.O.A.C.H. was starred ggodo, the man from R.O.A.C.H. was unstarred
    Image of shoroko shoroko
    12/05/09

    In reply to Dollhouse Gets Political, And Our Minds Are Blown
    I disagree on Bennet's behavior. Her mannerisms - the repetition, the way she looked away from the people she was speaking to or would speak to herself - reminded me a lot of certain behaviors associated with autism. That actually made the character seem very real to me, though I'll grant that given that her background story with Caroline was frustratingly vague, it was unclear whether we were supposed to take it the way I did, or as a "she's turned psychotic because of the betrayal" thing. I don't really like the latter possibility so much, at least not as anything more than explanation as to what "compromised her morals," so to speak. And I didn't mind her creepy little soliloquies - I liked how her setting kind of contrasted with Topher's. And Topher believing her to be an active would've bothered me more if he didn't actually have reason to think that, considering he'd... just basically done that himself, and she fit pretty well in to the Whiskey mold.

    Also, I was under the impression that Bennet basically decided from the moment they brought Echo in to let them both get away, as Perrin's handler would be the one set after him. She'd trigger the assassin mode so he'd kill them both, wake him after, and he'd do exactly what he did - and now they suddenly have this dead body to prove that he was the target of Rossum's enemies, and to fuel his imprinted ambition. Since he'd independently triggered the whole 'realizing he's a doll' thing and broke from the code he had with his handler, forcing him into a situation where he'd come back willingly might have been the better option than forcing it all back onto him. But that might be hitting convoluted. I just did get the impression that the how it turned out was Bennet's plan for it all along. Killing Echo just would've been a bonus.
     Reply
    shoroko was starred shoroko was unstarred
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