@DaveyNC: I live slightly above sea level at Crown Memorial State Beach along the San Francisco Bay. In my 40+ years I've watched almost 99 percent of the shellfish, crabs, leopard sharks and bat stingrays vanish from my neighborhood shore.
Who among the naysayers would like to bet their own money on this fantasy that oceans won't warm and sea levels won't be rising?
Anyone? This has nothing to do with Al Gore.
I've long since sold my truck and now commute exclusively via bus, train and bicycle. Yeah...it sucks balls when the weather is bad, but how hard is it to use City Share or Zipcar when driving is truly necessary?
I say put your money on it or STFU with this "it's normal" crap. I'm starting the bets at $5.
Unless you're sitting on three bibles to help keep your head up your ass, it's become abundantly clear that we're screwed.
@kolacek: "I live slightly above sea level at Crown Memorial State Beach along the San Francisco Bay. In my 40+ years I've watched almost 99 percent of the shellfish, crabs, leopard sharks and bat stingrays vanish from my neighborhood shore."
Sure, but those things likely have little or no relation to the "warming" part of ACC. You're on San Francisco Bay - whatever effects warming might have had on those critters are vastly outweighed by the effects of pollution, seacoast development, and fishing.
If you want to make a point, you should use good data that are clearly related to that point.
-Kle.
@Klebert L. Hall: The waters off the south side of my neighborhood are actually much cleaner than they were when the naval base was in full swing. From the time the base was built in the 40s to the time I was a kid, mercury levels were through the roof. Even with all of that pollution we still had amazingly vibrant sea life in the tidal pools 50 yards from my house. Marine life seems more able to metabolize poisonous chemicals than to deal with shifts in temperature.
And as far as development, etc...the entire west side of the island I live on has been sitting dormant since the base closed. If anything you'd expect sea life to return given almost two decades of isolation from building, fishing or recreation.
But don't just use Alameda as a measuring stick. Go down the coast to communities like Pacifica or El Granada. When I first started surfing as a kid the waters there were ice cold and teeming with ocean life. By contrast I've had days over the past 7 years where the water has been so warm I've had to unzip my wetsuit and take a break. You can sit on your board and feel warm currents even in the deep spots. El Nino or not, that is some freaky shit. Ever waded through a red tide?
Anyways - yes yes, I know I'm being anecdotal. Regardless of that I know what I see.
I'm thinking the folks in Greenland will enjoy having more land to grow crops on or raise livestock on. Should make them more self-sufficient. You know, the whole "eat local" thing. That would be green, wouldn't it? I mean, right now they probably have to ship a large portion of their fruits and vegetables in, I would think.
Climate change is normal and nothing new on the planet.
@DaveyNC: Climate change is normal. Yes, verily, it happens all the time.
But we still make our food through farming. One of the main reasons why America is so robust economically is that it can export so much grown food. Climate change, any climate change, would seriously jeopardize that economic power, as well as our ability to feed ourselves. And considering the climate is changing faster than we've measured it changing before, it would seem that this will be a problem fairly soon.
And that's just one side-effect. I'm sure you can think of more.
So, what's in our best interests? Keep in mind that any changes we make to our civilization in order to thwart our perceived effect on climate change, wrongly or otherwise, would most likely give us a better civilization in the process.
oh awesome we get a global warming argument today. here i thought i would be bored at work.
we still dont know our impact on the change in temperature due to the cyclical nature of the earth's weather patterns. also al gore the huge concern he shows every time he takes a private jet is heart warming.
Does it have Google Map directions from Clavius to the Monolith? I know it's tourist-y but I missed it last time because I was calibrating the antenna at Tchalinka.
Evil Tortie's Mom: R.O.A.C.H. promoted this comment
Edited by skippitymonster at 07/21/09 1:41 PM
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09/27/09
Who among the naysayers would like to bet their own money on this fantasy that oceans won't warm and sea levels won't be rising?
Anyone? This has nothing to do with Al Gore.
I've long since sold my truck and now commute exclusively via bus, train and bicycle. Yeah...it sucks balls when the weather is bad, but how hard is it to use City Share or Zipcar when driving is truly necessary?
I say put your money on it or STFU with this "it's normal" crap. I'm starting the bets at $5.
Unless you're sitting on three bibles to help keep your head up your ass, it's become abundantly clear that we're screwed.
E.
09/28/09
Sure, but those things likely have little or no relation to the "warming" part of ACC. You're on San Francisco Bay - whatever effects warming might have had on those critters are vastly outweighed by the effects of pollution, seacoast development, and fishing.
If you want to make a point, you should use good data that are clearly related to that point.
-Kle.
09/29/09
And as far as development, etc...the entire west side of the island I live on has been sitting dormant since the base closed. If anything you'd expect sea life to return given almost two decades of isolation from building, fishing or recreation.
But don't just use Alameda as a measuring stick. Go down the coast to communities like Pacifica or El Granada. When I first started surfing as a kid the waters there were ice cold and teeming with ocean life. By contrast I've had days over the past 7 years where the water has been so warm I've had to unzip my wetsuit and take a break. You can sit on your board and feel warm currents even in the deep spots. El Nino or not, that is some freaky shit. Ever waded through a red tide?
Anyways - yes yes, I know I'm being anecdotal. Regardless of that I know what I see.
09/27/09
Hm. Long coat. Absurdly long scarf. Mop of curly hair on top of the head...
All that's missing is a little robotic dog shaped like a toaster.
09/27/09
Climate change is normal and nothing new on the planet.
09/27/09
09/27/09
09/27/09
But we still make our food through farming. One of the main reasons why America is so robust economically is that it can export so much grown food. Climate change, any climate change, would seriously jeopardize that economic power, as well as our ability to feed ourselves. And considering the climate is changing faster than we've measured it changing before, it would seem that this will be a problem fairly soon.
And that's just one side-effect. I'm sure you can think of more.
So, what's in our best interests? Keep in mind that any changes we make to our civilization in order to thwart our perceived effect on climate change, wrongly or otherwise, would most likely give us a better civilization in the process.
09/27/09
we still dont know our impact on the change in temperature due to the cyclical nature of the earth's weather patterns. also al gore the huge concern he shows every time he takes a private jet is heart warming.
09/27/09
07/21/09