io9 
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San Francisco, 5:43 PM
Tue Dec 8
27 posts in the last 24 hours
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07:43 AM
Of course, that's where the money was, at the time.
"So what to make of Siege's Destruction McGuffin? A sign that, even if the rest of the world hasn't gotten over 9/11"
I think you'll find that most of the world got over 9/11 one hell of a long time ago... I expect the man on the street in the PRC isn't all broken up about it, for example... Especially after his own nation went through a much worse disaster since then. I doubt you'll find many people in India that haven't gotten over it, or on the African continent.
I'm pretty sure that the bulk of the world's population thinks of it as a minor historical event, actually.
Fiction regularly depicts much worse events - cities destroyed, nuclear wars, the collapse of civilization, the complete destruction of the Earth and human extinction.
Why is this comic book anything to even notice, much less complain about?
-Kle.
06:33 AM
12/07/09
Panel 1) Teeny tiny ship approaches from oooooooouter spaaaaaaaaace.
Panel 2) Ship crash lands on football field while giant fairy twinkles above.
Panel 3) Dust clears, confused football player looks on as random dude with terrible character design emerges from dust.
4) Meanwhile, on top of the billboard above the stadium, some random pink, orange, and grey dudes (when did Jack Kirby come back from the dead, heinously hungover, and vomit these character designs up?) stand at the ready.
5) Nonsensical backdrop panel featuring said interlopers (maybe?) firing up their powers, looking kind of forlorn (or something).
6) They fire their powers at the dude on the field, who apparently fires back and has the wherewithal to say "HA!"
7) Splodey.
12/07/09
05:32 AM
The bad guys are The U-Foes, Hulk villains with elemental powers. They were created to kill the Hulk and aren't happy about being turned into freaks. This is kind of beyond their previous power level, iirc.
The previous pages make this setup make more sense...but the artwork is really disjointed here. The story telling is....well, regrettable. It's just ridiculous. The biggest flaw in Bendis' approach to the Marvel Universe is that his attempts at bringing in 'realism' only highlights the disconnect with reality. I mean seriously...the Green Goblin being in charge of the US chief intelligence service and super-hero initiative? A totally unquestioning public? Brand New Day?
When you open up the comics to issues of SOME reality (as Civil War attempted to do) and then ignore huge swaths of issues that the same reality suggests, you only emphasize the lack of reality, which in turn makes the whole exercise kind of pointless.
08:29 AM
Recall that we, as omniscient third-person viewers looking in from outside the universe are privy to information that the average person on the street probably isn't. Most people in Marvel's America probably don't know that Norman Osborn was the Green Goblin, and even if it was public information it's probably been swept under the rug as shameful slander by a PR budget equal to the gross national product of Morocco.
12/07/09
When a bunch of heroes and villains are fighting in Manhattan, and somebody gets thrown through a building or whatever, do you really think that it's empty and no bystanders get hurt? Do you honestly think these cityscapes which are the backdrop for superheroics magically deplete themselves of the humdrum normals that usually live there?
The reason this Siege thing pisses me off isn't because of the content, but the context: I think Marvel has the kernels of good ideas here but they're going to be planted in fallow creative soil. They're going to probably squander this like they have the events of Civil War, Secret Invasion, House of M and all the rest of the stillbirths from the last five years. The only one that's struck me as anything resembling intellectual honesty was World War Hulk, because the normal people of the Marvel universe welcomed somebody who was going to make heroes accountable, who was going to try and cap the madness, and those people were not painted as "dirty hippy" loons.
12/07/09
I just want more intellectually honest MU stories.
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12/07/09
This is probably one of the dumbest things I've read on i09.
For one thing, let us get this out of the way real quick: This is a FICTIONAL STORY.
So, what? In a post 9/11 world, large scale death can no longer be used as a plot device? Or, any time it is used, it must be IMMEDIATELY compared to 9/11?
Comparing this to 9/11 is a stretch. And not just a little one.
I for one see no correlation between the real life terrorist attacks on Septermber 11th and the completely fictional death of 50,000 Chicagoans. Marvel hasn't seemed to make any attempt to draw that parallel, either. Indeed, they're trying to draw a connection between this event and Stamford... which is ANOTHER fake tragedy.
So, to call this in bad taste? Thoughtless? I'm sorry, I don't see that. I think that is a grand overreaction to the events in a comic book.
And to your other point, that this is big bad evil supervillainy... well, YEAH.
Norman Osborne is a complete and utter psychotic! He spent a few decades dressing up like a green lunatic and throwing explosive pumpkins at people.
What the fuck did you think was going to happen when a guy like that got almost unlimited access to defense department resources/budgets?
He decided he wanted to make a case for war against Asgard, and did. Osborne doesn't care how many bodies he has to step over to reach his goals or keep his power.
THAT'S WHY HE'S EVIL.
If anything, I think Marvel should be applauded from not backing away from the almost inevitable consequence of putting a god damn SUPERVILLAIN in control of a major political office. To date, the Marvel Universe has gotten off light, with Stormin' Norman mostly acting behind the scenes, or bidding his time.
In other words: Yes. You're being overly sensitive about this. Sooner or later, someone is going to put a bunch of people together in a fictional context, and kill them in a way that MIGHT remind you of 9/11.
But that's okay. We shouldn't forget 9/11. And I don't think any of us ever will. But that doesn't mean we need to all lose our damn minds every time something might possibly maybe remind us of that one time something bad happened.
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12/07/09
then there's Xanshi. Sure it's not Earth, but a whole planet was destroyed!!
Actually Crisis On Infinite Earths destroyed a lot more than anything else, it destroyed the Multiverse!
12/07/09
In the end, time passage, geographic proximity, as well as personal attachments greatly impact the memory of an event. Memories and pain are supposed to dull with time. They're designed that way for reason.
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I don't know if Ennis's The Boys is that political though, it reminded me of The Authority except 100 times more cynical.Then again, I sort of gave up 6 issues in cause it was that repulsive to me.
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12/07/09
And yeah I LOVED Welcome Back, Frank. The single line dismissal of the previous reboot and punching a polar bear in the face both still make me laugh:)
11:28 AM
12/07/09
As far is Marvel is concerned, their superhero universe is based in the real world are they never to show a villain blowing up a real world setting again simply because their offices are in New York?
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12/07/09
And you just know Wilson Fisk is gonna haul off some of that WTC rubble and sell it for scrap to the Maggia.
12/07/09
12/07/09
Second,how is this in anyway related to the 9/11. It's been 8 years for christ's sake. Does a publisher have a right to publish something about a large scale terrorist attack without being associated with 9/11? After all, terrorists weren't invented with 9/11. They have always been there: French Resistance, Guy Faulks (don't know if I spell that right), US Independentist, they were all considered terrorist at one point or another.
Third, we are talking about Loki here. The GOD of trickery.
Fourth, I'm just tired of 9/11 connections right now, especially whe they are dubious at best. Brits do not keep talking about the London bombing in every single thing they make (at least, not that I know of.) It's like your President obssesion. No other country would make a movie with the President as the hero.
12/07/09
On some level, I can understand having the villains drop out of character and admit that they exist to entertain, not to terrify. There's a great James Morrow story where all the giant monsters of the '50s and '60s show up after 9/11 and try to put the city back together. But in the real world, you can bet they'd be exploiting every angle of a national tragedy and its aftermath. (I''m sure the good guys would make out pretty well, too.)
12/07/09
I totally agree. Years from now if someone reads a current Marvel book, referencing Obama or something similar, it'll seem very dated. That's why I like DC. They don't make pointless references to current events, so years from now if someone reads a DC book with the president they'll just think, "Oh, they used a fictional President."
12/07/09
Can I call 9/11 fail?
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11:33 AM
12/07/09
I wish I had some relevant comic book examples but I rarely read them.
12/07/09
yeahhh.. I'm stretching with that last one. my point is that 2012 can be considered less offense than bombing a stadium... cuz.. um I dunno it was an accident that LA fell into the ocean?
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Both are evil geniuses, but Doom while selfish and arrogant, would never stoop to using massive casualties to get his way. It's 'bad form' and it is misdirection. If he wanted a war he'd damn well start it himself.
Osborn is an evil genius of a different stripe. He doesn't care how he gets what he wants as long as he ends up on top, and he's never been all that squeamish about casualties. If the path to what he desires includes the blood of thousands ol' Normie won't stop to think about it for a second.