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San Francisco, 8:12 PM
Sun Nov 29
11 posts in the last 24 hours
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10/28/09
Literature, film and art are derivative of past efforts. The extent to which one is influenced does matter, but it's wrong to pick and chose who gets scorn and who gets praised. There's nothing wrong with seeing a great story and being inspired by it, and that is how some of the best material was created. Without that, we'd have a tiny collection of books and film.
Look at the many examples cited right here of stories all very similar regarding the avatar-like premise, and ask which of those likewise should be derided as unoriginal rip-offs.
Cameron is one of many writers who used the concept of human minds transported into alien bodies. Nor is the notion of "going feral" rare -- someone mentioned werewolves, and that's what I thought of as well. Early writers riffed on other concepts, developed new versions of old ideas, and then many of them used the same new versions.
I understand everyone's concern about actual plagiarism (I am a screenwriter, so the matter is one I take seriously), but I feel the term is too loosely applied to Cameron, and that he catches an undo amount of criticism. He's made great films and great contributions to sci-fi -- as have many other writers who relied on derivative concepts clearly inspired by their writing peers.
10/28/09
10/26/09
It worked for George Lucas!
Oh yeah, and in music it worked for Led Zeppelin who pulled the gold fillings out of old bluesmen's mouths without as much as a tip of the hat.
Well, until latter in their careers when they were pressured to grudging parted with a few 'quid' to settle claims and silence critics. #avatar
10/26/09
Wow, I have that issue in the basement, and I have it in a collection or two as well, because I always tried to have every story Poul ever wrote. Poul Anderson's stories were my first love in the field (I went on to Jack Vance afterward). That's why when I was able to buy John Schoenherr's cover for THE LONGEST VOYAGE, I snapped it up years ago, on a visit to John's studio.
Yes, the 1970s were very good to me. #avatar
10/26/09
10/27/09
Best. Plagiarism defence. Ever.
"I don't read much!" #avatar
10/26/09
Proof that even though I may have a star, nobody's reading my comments. Srsly. Go back and look at my postings on any Avatar article here on io9. I've been beating this drum forever.
And I hope Karen and Astrid get a huuuuge chunk of money and Poul gets a mention -- though, of course, they're not as litigious as Harlan (who is?). #avatar
10/26/09
10/26/09
10/26/09
10/26/09
@Allen_Richards: And this... this is going right up Ellison's ass!
10/26/09
10/26/09
10/26/09
10/26/09
10/27/09
11/12/09
11/12/09
But thanks anyway. #avatar
10/26/09
and it doesnot surprise me about this post.when naming a band or writing a story/film one should do their research first to see if it has been used before.
folks do not take the time to do this step nor do they care.
my 1st punk band The Transplants from the 1970's has releases out and still get back together for reunions and are asked to be on present day comps but we still had our name stolen by some lame bigwig label schmucks who should of known better as all you had to do was look in your computer.go ahead and see on google.now these young ones could of just looked it up and easily then the could of used another name.
my astounding collection is 1930's issues.
10/26/09
Terminator= Demon With the Glass Hand as mentioned
Aliens= Starship Troopers
The Abyss= Into the Abyss by HG Wells
Strange Days= Tek War
I mean come on guys, the guy has been basically ripping off the greats ((and not so greats)) of Science Fiction his entire Career, why should his newest film be a suprise?
10/26/09
10/26/09
However, I care far less about this than I care about the question about whether Avatar is a good movie. If it is, then Cameron has my thanks. #avatar
10/26/09
As for Cameron's use of influences, the mistake he made in Harlan's case was that he specifically said to a mutual friend that Harlan's two episodes of the Outer Limits were the foundation for the Terminator movie. Had he said Harlan, the Deathlok comics from Marvel in the 70s (which use similar visual typeface for the cyborg's POV), and the old sf anthology Science Fiction Thinking Machines, he might have been on more solid ground opposing Harlan's complaint, but it would have cost more money to challenge it than to settle. Not that I begrudge Harlan in any respect on this matter, mind you, but you do notice that major Hollywood directors generally don't tell you who they read for fun or who they read during their formative years. Movies, yes, books no.
I haven't looked at the latest Avatar trailers, but my first impression was that the whole look of the thing is influenced by Michael Whelan's art work, particularly in the use of color. But in case anyone wants to sue him, Cameron (who reportedly was bitter over the Ellison conflict) can always fall back to saying he was influenced by Snowcrash.
By the way, sf authors of the Golden Age and just beyond never really expected a lot from Hollywood — Simak saw one of his stories being adapted for The Outer Limits and wondered aloud why they were doing it so badly — but they did resent it, slightly, as sf films became more profitable and their ideas, or the natural evolutionary result of their ideas, were appropriated. Blues and R&B artists felt the same way during the British Invasion in the 60s, until of course those royalty checks came in and their own audiences expanded. SF writers weren't so lucky.
And oh yes, the ultimate human in an alien body story is Robert Sheckley's Mindswap. I'd like to see Avatar influenced by that! #avatar
10/26/09
10/26/09
We know you wouldn't do this sort of thing on purpose, but we know he does. #avatar
10/26/09