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San Francisco, 7:02 AM
Wed Nov 11
30 posts in the last 24 hours

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    Dsmvwl  Admin  Promote to frontpage Approve user Ban user ×
    Image of Starwatcher Starwatcher
    11/10/09

    In reply to The New York Times Columnist Who's Helping To Ruin The Future
    I'm a skeptic by nature, but I'm also in the 'better safe than sorry camp, so I tend to side with the environmentalists on this. That said, I do find it interesting that many religious right whackos are starting to jump on the global warming bandwagon. If that's not a good indicator that there's problems with the science, then I don't know what is. #ecology
     Reply
    Starwatcher was starred Starwatcher was unstarred
    Image of Klebert L. Hall Klebert L. Hall
    11/10/09

    In reply to The New York Times Columnist Who's Helping To Ruin The Future
    He probably believes things because he wants them to be true.

    It's important to remember that politics corrupts science at least as much as industry does, though. There isn't really a lot of scientific objectivity around, anymore.
    -Kle. #ecology
     Reply
    Klebert L. Hall was starred Klebert L. Hall was unstarred
    Image of cylon_conspiracy cylon_conspiracy
    11/09/09

    In reply to The New York Times Columnist Who's Helping To Ruin The Future
    There is no scientific consensus on global warming. "Fire burns", consensus. Man-made global warming (or climate change as you guys are calling it now just in case things get cooler), no consensus.

    "Political science" isn't meant to be taken literally.
     Reply
    Edited by cylon_conspiracy at 11/09/09 11:00 PM cylon_conspiracy was starred cylon_conspiracy was unstarred
    Image of Byronotron Byronotron
    11/09/09

    @cylon_conspiracy: this is the very problem with the concept of the singularity; noise on the grid. How do we teach a computer, or more importantly, how does it teach itself what is the most accurate information? Garbage in, Garbage out. The singularity will lead us to doom if the "final solution" has incorrect data. The main problem of the internet age is that with a million voices screaming nonsense the voices of truth get drowned out. this will only get worse, as our capability to process data increases. data must be interpreted by humans, that is where the promise of the singularity is hollow, it still relies on human judgement, which is fallible. #ecology
     Reply
    Byronotron was starred Byronotron was unstarred
    Image of Skunky Skunky
    11/10/09

    @Byronotron: Sounds like we'll all end up in one big game of "Paranoia."

    [en.wikipedia.org]

    The computer is your friend. #ecology
     Reply
    Skunky was starred Skunky was unstarred
    Image of wanion wanion
    11/09/09

    In reply to The New York Times Columnist Who's Helping To Ruin The Future
    "but I think it's naive to ignore the trend of the past century - or the past 10,000 years."

    Oh really, 10,000 whole years? Wow, a species manages to stick around for a few millennia and and it's all set to discover perpetual motion, fairy dust, or whatever fantasy technology it's going to take to bring about his bright, exponentially expanding, no-strings-attached future.

    Which is just going off his opening about how the critics of his Kurzweil love letter believe: "that, just as bacteria proliferating in a petri dish will eventually exhaust the resources, we too will hit a limit. I think these skeptics are missing the lessons of history"
    What's the lesson? That just because humans haven't yet hit a limit on the finite amount of resources on the planet, that there must not be one?

    And then there's this: "Unlike Malthus, we can look around and see that we already have the energy and technology to feed a larger population than exists on Earth today." Yes, I'm sure it's easy to see when you're sitting around in New York, in the United States, and not, say, some country where starvation is a routine occurrence. I'm sure JT can also see how much bigger a population we can feed and also when we'll have to stop the growth of the human population at its current rate, and also how to do this without hurting anybody's feelings. #ecology
     Reply
    wanion was starred wanion was unstarred
    Image of Anekanta - Space Hippy! Anekanta - Space Hippy!
    11/09/09

    In reply to The New York Times Columnist Who's Helping To Ruin The Future
    Well put CJ. This Tierney dude sounds incredibly naive about problems like poverty, famine, and disease which already exist today--which seems inexcusable for a science columnist for a major newspaper.

    Unfortunately this is pretty common--an unwavering faith in progress that denies the reality that nothing in this world comes without consequences. #ecology
     Reply
    Anekanta - Space Hippy! was starred Anekanta - Space Hippy! was unstarred
    Image of Byronotron Byronotron
    11/09/09

    @Anekanta - Space Hippy!: A technophile in the most white-bourgeois-consumer sense of the word. The ignorance inherent in his ideas is crippling. The very existence of technology provides salvation? The same way that technology provided the salvation with the IBM indexing computers in Germany? Technology cannot exist in a vacuum of morality or rational guidance. #ecology
     Reply
    Byronotron was starred Byronotron was unstarred
    Image of Anekanta - Space Hippy! Anekanta - Space Hippy!
    11/10/09

    @Byronotron: Indeed! #ecology
     Reply
    Anekanta - Space Hippy! was starred Anekanta - Space Hippy! was unstarred
    Image of DrMathochist DrMathochist
    11/09/09

    In reply to The New York Times Columnist Who's Helping To Ruin The Future
    (a) Tierney's neither a skeptic nor overly gullible; he's a contrarian. He's the guy in the audience at Cloverfield rooting for the monster.

    (b) As I and every other mathematician keep saying, EXPONENTIAL GROWTH DOES NOT LEAD TO A SINGULARITY. THERE IS NO BLOW-UP IN FINITE TIME UNDER THESE CONDITIONS. THIS IS COVERED IN CALCULUS 2, PEOPLE! #ecology
     Reply
    DrMathochist was starred DrMathochist was unstarred
    Image of FunkyJ FunkyJ
    11/09/09

    In reply to The New York Times Columnist Who's Helping To Ruin The Future
    Funny how you bash Tierney for believing in myths, but then fall for one of the biggest myths about humankind - the Dark Ages.

    The Dark Ages were a myth, expounded by Renaissance scholars and those with an axe to grind against the Roman Catholic Church.

    Recent excavations and discoveries in Europe and England have revealed the whole idea that humanity dwindled into a technological and social backwater is, in the words on one scholar, pure bollocks.

    Watch just one season of Time Team and you'll quickly come to realise the Europeans of that time were far from technologically and socially backwards. #ecology
     Reply
    FunkyJ was starred FunkyJ was unstarred
    Image of TheGreat&PowerfulTurtle TheGreat&PowerfulTurtle
    11/09/09

    In reply to The New York Times Columnist Who's Helping To Ruin The Future
    Are you kidding? Libertarian Randroids and Transhumanism go together like peanut butter and bacon.
     Reply
    Edited by TheGreat&PowerfulTurtle at 11/09/09 4:09 PM TheGreat&PowerfulTurtle was starred TheGreat&PowerfulTurtle was unstarred
    Image of The_Sporean_Bob The_Sporean_Bob
    11/09/09

    @TheGreat&PowerfulTurtle: HAHAHAHA, Randroids!
    Do I have your permission to use that term? #ecology
     Reply
    TheGreat&PowerfulTurtle promoted this comment The_Sporean_Bob was starred The_Sporean_Bob was unstarred
    Image of TheGreat&PowerfulTurtle TheGreat&PowerfulTurtle
    11/09/09

    @The_Sporean_Bob: I wish I could claim it as my invention.

    [en.wikipedia.org] #ecology
     Reply
    TheGreat&PowerfulTurtle was starred TheGreat&PowerfulTurtle was unstarred
    Image of HeartBurnKid: Agent of R.O.A.C.H. HeartBurnKid: Agent of R.O.A.C.H.
    11/09/09

    In reply to The New York Times Columnist Who's Helping To Ruin The Future
    Interesting he should refer to the folks he disagrees with as Cassandras... IIRC, wasn't Cassandra completely correct in everything she prophesized, but cursed so that nobody would listen to a word she said? #ecology
     Reply
    HeartBurnKid: Agent of R.O.A.C.H. was starred HeartBurnKid: Agent of R.O.A.C.H. was unstarred
    Image of Evil Tortie's Mom: R.O.A.C.H. Evil Tortie's Mom: R.O.A.C.H.
    11/09/09

    @HeartBurnKid: Agent of R.O.A.C.H.: Exactly. She was 100% correct.

    So the irony here is staggering, and he obviously doesn't realize it. #ecology
     Reply
    Evil Tortie's Mom: R.O.A.C.H. was starred Evil Tortie's Mom: R.O.A.C.H. was unstarred
    Image of Fedaykin Fedaykin
    11/09/09

    @Evil Tortie's Mom: R.O.A.C.H.: My thought exactly. And if I demand nothing else from my Times columnists, it's a proper use of metaphors referencing Hellenic mythology. #ecology
     Reply
    Evil Tortie's Mom: R.O.A.C.H. promoted this comment Fedaykin was starred Fedaykin was unstarred
    Image of Byronotron Byronotron
    11/09/09

    @Fedaykin: haha, well his misuse is the whole head smacking point. he said the EXACT OPPOSITE of what he was trying to, and thus shows the depth of his ineptitude. #ecology
     Reply
    Byronotron was starred Byronotron was unstarred
    Image of cylon_conspiracy cylon_conspiracy
    11/09/09

    @HeartBurnKid: Agent of R.O.A.C.H.: Woody Allen made a movie about that. #ecology
     Reply
    cylon_conspiracy was starred cylon_conspiracy was unstarred
    Image of Elizabeth Weinbloom Elizabeth Weinbloom
    11/09/09

    In reply to The New York Times Columnist Who's Helping To Ruin The Future
    Wonderful column! Lots of things to think about. Should keep me occupied while I eat my Singularity-provided unlimited rice pudding. #ecology
     Reply
    Elizabeth Weinbloom was starred Elizabeth Weinbloom was unstarred
    Image of Jeremy Tapsell Jeremy Tapsell
    11/09/09

    In reply to The New York Times Columnist Who's Helping To Ruin The Future
    ok.. so that didnt work.

    Hmmmmmm
    :P
     Reply
    Edited by Jeremy Tapsell at 11/09/09 2:35 PM Jeremy Tapsell was starred Jeremy Tapsell was unstarred
    Image of Chip Skylark of Space Chip Skylark of Space
    11/09/09

    In reply to The New York Times Columnist Who's Helping To Ruin The Future

    Wasn't "Malthus Vs. The Singularity" an episode of CHUCK? The one where Bryce Larkin bailed out for WHITE COLLAR? #ecology
     Reply
    Chip Skylark of Space was starred Chip Skylark of Space was unstarred
    Image of Jeremy Tapsell Jeremy Tapsell
    11/09/09

    In reply to The New York Times Columnist Who's Helping To Ruin The Future

    #ecology
     Reply
    Jeremy Tapsell was starred Jeremy Tapsell was unstarred
    Image of gorehound gorehound
    11/09/09

    In reply to The New York Times Columnist Who's Helping To Ruin The Future
    I am no real scientist but to me it does not take a lot of intelligence to realize if you keep putting trash somewhere it will effect the area.
    Just keep putting pollution into the air and it will do something bad.
    Yes the Earth does go thru climate cycles and we all know that one but greenhouse gasses do bring as temperature up and that one is proved in labs.
    As far as I think nowadays I will go on record as stating that Global Warming is due to both the natural Earth Climate along with us polluting the air.Both things are happening and both are casuing climate issues. #ecology
     Reply
    gorehound was starred gorehound was unstarred
    Image of Roklimber Roklimber
    11/09/09

    In reply to The New York Times Columnist Who's Helping To Ruin The Future
    "We have decades to figure out ways to deal with it: to find carbon-free sources of energy, to develop techniques for removing carbon from the atmosphere or geoengineering the climate, or simply to adapt."

    We have decades? Where's the evidence for that? Moreover, if it boils down to adapting, I'd like to remind Mr. Tierney that species do NOT adapt to significant changes to the environment in a matter of decades, not even us oh-mighty humans. #ecology
     Reply
    Roklimber was starred Roklimber was unstarred
    Image of Jonny_eh Jonny_eh
    11/09/09

    @Roklimber: And adaptation usually requires the weak to die out. That's how evolution works. As humans, we want everyone to live, not just the best adapted. #ecology
     Reply
    Roklimber promoted this comment Jonny_eh was starred Jonny_eh was unstarred
    Image of Roklimber Roklimber
    11/09/09

    @Jonny_eh: Indeed. #ecology
     Reply
    Roklimber was starred Roklimber was unstarred
    Image of SkippyTheMarine SkippyTheMarine
    11/09/09

    @Roklimber: Actually they do. Take a look at the London Moth. In preindustrial London they were pure white, which allowed them to better blend in with marble facades that dominated the public architecture of that time. After the revolution, and London turned from a white city to a gray and brown one, these moths stood out and were eaten by the local pigeons. Within a few decades the gene that made the moths white were rooted out, and now they are all gray. This took a matter of decades. This also goes for the samurai crab off of the coast of Japan and...I don't know...how about anti-biotic resistant bacteria.

    When there is a need to evolve or adapt with speed, biological systems will find a way. #ecology
     Reply
    Roklimber promoted this comment SkippyTheMarine was starred SkippyTheMarine was unstarred
    Image of Roklimber Roklimber
    11/10/09

    @SkippyTheMarine: Yes, those are excellent examples (the moth is a classic) but they're all species with a very short sexual-maturation period when compared to decades, large reproduction rate (large numbers of offsprings per parent), and/or large populations of "available partners". Except for viruses, which don't reproduce sexually, but simply mutate at a large enough rate.

    Humans have none of those characteristics, so our species' "rate of evolution" is much slower than that of those examples you mentioned.
     Reply
    Edited by Roklimber at 11/10/09 1:33 AM Roklimber was starred Roklimber was unstarred
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